Bible teacher George W. Greene of InYourBible.com has a follow up, to his extensive teaching of the erred doctrine of “church tithing”. It is titled How to Stop Tithing, but really it is a guide for those who have already learned what today is called “tithing” in the church is unbiblical and how to respond to critics, that may try and pull you back into legalism. Check out the videos below, or if you think “tithing” is good then please first see The Truth About Tithing - Video Series.
Please withhold comments till viewing the videos below in full.
In addition to all that brother Greene explained. I want you to consider that as a Christian, you should avoid making any vows at all.
Matthew 5:33-37 (New American Standard Bible)
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Given what you saw in the video, you know full well, that anybody trying to guilt you into paying 10% is wrong, 2 Corinthians 9:7.
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August 21st, 2008 at 7:11 pm
Good perspective. He takes on the spiritual bondage created by tithing to churches. Pointing out that many are bound by the vows they have made to tithe was excellent. He showed from exegesis that such vows were made under duress, that is, by their leaders falsely invoking the requirement for them to tithe. In such a case, a vow is automatically nullified.
Another bondage he brought out (in the first video) is how stopping tithing will incur the displeasure of leadership and other members who are still bound to the tithe.
I know about that personally. Sadly, I have to admit that I believed in and taught tithing years ago; and, being on the admin board, I recommended that members who were being considered for leadership should be tithers (as proof of their commitment to the church.).
It’s impossible to undo all that damage. It is important to repent and teach against it whenever needed.
ncatina reply on August 21st, 2008 at 7:47 pm :
Stan, all of what you mentioned are my sentiments exactly. The common factor with every scripture mentioned to help falsely support tithing is all done under duress. This is the antithesis of 2 Corinthians 9:7 where Jesus says SPECIFICALLY not to give under duress. “Cheerful” giving cannot be done with the threats (however empty) of receiving the wrath and curse of God and all manner of bad circumstances consistent with not tithing, supposedly.
As a matter of fact, my former church in PHL is running a week-long conference this week, seen on streamingfaith.com. It’s “in the name of maximizing faith” the pastor is pushing all manner of tactics (and has flown in additional speakers) to have people give for the sake of acquiring a new edifice AND obtain a parcel of land for the sake of BUILDING yet another building, all for the sake of “creating a legacy.” Nearly everything mentioned regarding the pressure placed on the congregation to give until it hurts was present. The quest for money grubbing is quite blatant.
I found it an interesting mention of Mr. Greene to note 1 Timothy 5:8 regarding taking care of on’e household ahead of forking over money indisciminitely to church leadership. Here in PHL, the unemployment rate, especially among blacks, is quite high with many more working for poverty wages just to survive. I know of people formerly and currently involved in this church that cannot afford to give to the degree that they are being pushed to do so. It’s sad, especially in the face of various charity drives going on in the region to get school supplies for kids because the parents can’t afford. It makes you wonder why….
stan reply on August 21st, 2008 at 8:10 pm :
Ncatina, Thank God you’re not bound to that predatory practice. It is a shame, as you point out about PHL (I live about 85 miles from the city in New Jersey), that so many of the poor of that city ( and everywhere else) are being ripped off by legacy-hunting pastors.
Unfortunately, the people themselves have the mistaken notion that Jesus died to get us out of all our earthly problems; and that tithing is a way of securing it. It is this notion that keeps these predators in business, sitting in the catbird seat.
Tithing to get wealthy is like spitting to quench your thirst.
ncatina reply on August 22nd, 2008 at 11:39 am :
Stan, another aspect I was thinking about that Mr. Greene mentioned was the entire “concept” of “tithing” one’s time and talents (or intangible gifts). For the two organizations I was once part of, the concept of “tithing your time/talents” was heavily promoted. Just as you were expected to give of your money, you were also expected to serve time (sounds like a prison, doesn’t it) submitted to doing work in the church. For years, I, and many others, believed that it was biblical to spend virtually all of our free time at the church doing ___________ (you fill in the blank). In my seven-and-a-half years, I easily spent 6 - 10 hours/week in church excluding services, not including the commute cross-town on public transit. I am single with no children, yet I treated my apartment like a hotel room. Thank God I changed that when I moved to the house!
It has also become such a sophisiticated system now that annual “ministry assessments” (glorified personality tests) are given to members to identify one’s skill set(s). This helps determine more effectively where people can be placed into doing what I call slave work. Other than prayer and caring for those is need (sick, widowed, poor, evangelism, discipleship), I have yet to see in scripture where ANYTHING else is a mandate for church work. This is an example of working for one’s grace when Jesus has given it to us freely with His ultimate sacrifice. These actiities are all designed to rip people for their time, talent, energy AND money for the exclusive benefit to the organization/overseer, and direct detriment of the giver.
It is now par-for-the-course to go onto any mega-church’s website to see dozens of “ministries” (auxillaries where people can “volunteer” their time) posted. It is modern-day slave labor on the mega-church plantation that allows them to flourish with hundreds of people scattered on work detail any given day of the week. No doubt if all volunteers were being paid, the churches would be bankrupt. Because so many people involved in these “ministries” serving within the church see the organiztion as God Himself, once they burn out and contemplate leaving, out of misguided fear, they feel they will leave God Himself.
I am grateful Mr. Greene has put forward these videos. Straight teaching and no hype.
stan reply on August 22nd, 2008 at 5:18 pm :
Ncatina, I have heard that same argument about tithing your time (and I used it back then). So, was it based on a tenth of the 168 hour week (about 17 hours) or based on one tenth of the waking week (1/3 off to 112 hours) to 11 hours or one tenth of the non-working hours (another third or so off) making it about 5.5 hours a week? You’d need a time clock with things like payroll cards to handle that strict accounting.
These actiities are all designed to rip people for their time, talent, energy AND money for the exclusive benefit to the organization/overseer, and direct detriment of the giver.
You’re right. Since pastors have arbitrarily (without scriptural mandate) created little empires with palaces (church buildings) as their capitols, and them as kings; you become the serfs. This is an ongoing fulfillment of what the Lord said to the Israelites when they wanted a king like other nations (1 Sam 8:11-18). For such misappropriations of God’s servants for their own legacy, they must answer for it one day; for it is in direct disobedience to Mark 10:42-43 and 1 Pet 5:3.
Because so many people involved in these “ministries” serving within the church see the organiztion as God Himself, once they burn out and contemplate leaving, out of misguided fear, they feel they will leave God Himself.
Right on!
Money, money, money. The desire for it ruins so many and the church is not exempt. That love is thorns growing up to choke off the Word. God protect us from that temptation.
IndependentConservative reply on August 22nd, 2008 at 5:31 pm :
Stan you know the BAD TRADITION known as “church tithing” is always based on GROSS. So you’d have to give 17 hours
.
Even when I was caught up in the 10% scam, I didn’t really “get” the “tithe your time” concept. I thought Christians were always supposed to do good continually as we are able. I never put any stock in having to have 10% of my “time” at “home church”.
Some assemblies are able to use things like an “assessment” of members’ skills, abilities and seeing what the Lord has gifted the members with, without using the information for abusive purposes. Some use it to help saints better realize how they might be most effective in doing good works and ministry. But the pimps, anything given to them is bound to be abused.
stan reply on August 22nd, 2008 at 6:16 pm :
Amen to the always-doing-good issue.
The “time tithe” was most often a way of tithing in lieu of money, from the policies I remember on that subject. Ncatina’s experience was that the church demanded both time and money tithes. And the service tithe was primarily on behalf of the church facility itself or its attending workload. No special regard given necessarily to the person’s calling.
I know that many Christian schools allow a parent to tithe time when they were short on tuition. They could be conscripted to become drivers, chaperones, office workers, fundraising chairpersons and workers, teacher and coach assistants, etc., to meet their shortfall. In that case, though, there is a legitimate debt that the parent’s time offsets. A monetary value is assigned by the school ahead of time to the work to be done so that the tuition’s balance due can be slowly satisfied.
Yet, predatorily, the same attitude and procedure is taken by tithing churches like Ncatina spoke of, based on the premise that the money tithe is a legitimate debt that can be offset the same way by certain labors that the church itself creates to be done. They do not regard the person’s own calling in that calculation, unless, by chance, the work assigned to a particular individual is within that person’s calling. The abuse comes with believers not being able to fulfill their own God-given ministry because so much of their time is taken up in these arbitrary duties. So, if someone admits to not being able to tithe monetarily, they’ll end up with double duty for the church (read: pastor’s empire). So, what’s double duty then- 34 hours? Oy vey. Hence, burn out, resentment and unresolved guilt. The root of bitterness springing up to defile many; and all created over money.
August 21st, 2008 at 9:42 pm
IC, do you or anyone here know any church in NY metro area that doesn’t tithe? I would really appreciate hearing from you.
IndependentConservative reply on August 21st, 2008 at 10:12 pm :
Hi key2truth, like I mentioned I really don’t.
August 22nd, 2008 at 12:58 am
Remember: Tithes are paid; Alms are given.
We are called to be givers. We are to give according to our means, how we purpose in our own hearts and not under any compulsion or for ulterior motives (like getting back 100 fold); otherwise it’s not giving.
August 22nd, 2008 at 11:12 am
I’m so glad that this is being addressed, because I’ve studied the grace of giving by The Apostle Paul in the New Testament. And have need to study it again.
The Days of the building fund and pastor’s legacy is becoming disheartening. All the while some pastors will tell you selectively that some things were nailed to the cross, while others were not, according to their selection it seems!
Keep it up I.C.!
August 22nd, 2008 at 12:39 pm
Blessings all,
IC thanks for posting this. Just to show how deeply rooted this false practice is: I am the Pastor of a bi-weekly meeting House Church here in NYC. Many in our fellowship attend other churches, and some attend Mega -’churches’. Two months ago, I gave my folks the option of two topics to study for our meeting. One was the so-called tithe. They ALL voted to study the other topic. In later one on one discussions, several told me that they would have liked to discuss it, but were either afraid, thought they knew all there was to know (Malachi 3), or thought that I was going to try to pimp them (as they are being pimped at the churches they go to)
Well, this morning, I sent them all links to Mr. Green’s websites and videos, and I pray that they do so…
IC, Thank you for this blog. It continues to bless me.
I pray that God will continue to bless you
IndependentConservative reply on August 22nd, 2008 at 12:58 pm :
CT Jermin, your prayers are always appreciated
.
August 22nd, 2008 at 3:59 pm
key2truth asked who are the non-tithing churches in the NY area.
I’ve had the same problem here in San Diego. I settled for a church that although it tithes, the pastor just seemed to be the least greedy about it. In fact, he sometimes acts like he doesn’t like talking about money.
However, it does asks on leadership position and volunteer applications if you tithe or not. I applied to work on church security and tithing was a question. Mr. Greene said something in the video about not hiding that fact if it’s required. I had done just that and even wrote on the application, “I guess I’m disqualified because I tithe, oh well!”
Amazingly, I was still hired! So far, not a word has been said to me about that application.
Christocentric reply on August 22nd, 2008 at 4:01 pm :
correction: that should have read, “I guess I’m disqualified because I DON’T tithe…”
August 22nd, 2008 at 5:37 pm
CT Jermin, nice reading your piece. Glad to hear that you are in the NY metro area. I would really love to get in touch with your group. Do you mind telling me your exact location?
Christocentric, I’m glad you found a church that knows upfront that you don’t believe in tithing and still took you in. Now you really have to prayerfully transform them from inside out since you are armed with the truth!
God bless you all.
IndependentConservative reply on August 22nd, 2008 at 5:44 pm :
CT Jermin, if you’d like I can send key2truth your e-mail address?
August 23rd, 2008 at 10:39 pm
I have Been a financial failure Most of my adult Life,I’ve Shed tears of Shame privately before My Lord many Times and Have many times Not went to Worship on Sunday Morning because I couldn’t ‘Give Unto the Lord As I was taught or Thought thats what God wanted.Oh, I gave small amounts and at times I was Blessed to give a few Large amounts mainly due to windfalls.I believe My largest amount for one Year was $650.The Church I attended for 26 years taught Tithing was 10% 0f my net income.I always dreaded the end of the year when we were to commit The amount We were to Give the Following Year.Usually I would Put a amount Knowing in My heart I wouldn’t keep up My faith Pledge for the new year.After 26 years My church Built a new family Christian center of Which We were ask To Commit too that in addition to the Tithe That I was already such a Failure at, In My mind.I knew I was finished ,I did not commit to Buying a brick as they built the wall one Sunday morning In front of the Congregation,on your Brick you walked forward and Put a $ amount on “Your” brick.I thought in my mind If I can’t meet my tithe how was I ever going to meet this Commitment? 2 weeks later after 26 years I Left My Church Home of 26 years.I had a few close friends call with a tepid where You been, We miss you but those Soon stopped ,That always has pained My heart but It was, as it was.One point in My failure I’m reminded in my thoughts that if God was mad at me, why is My Life So Blessed?That was reassuring to realize that truth in My Life ,even too this very day. I also realize Now that I’m to Give too God not only Money but others things as well,The one thing thats constant in our Lives is Gods Word ,I’m now set free form that bondage through the Words of 2 Corinthians Chapter 9 verse 7-Praise Be to God for His everlasting Word…even in the midst of My financial Failure—–
August 25th, 2008 at 10:01 pm
IC did you see the clip, “God Pie”. It is the latest method used to send church members on a guilt trip.
IndependentConservative reply on August 25th, 2008 at 10:10 pm :
Yea I’ve seen it.
Considering Matthew 25:31-46, I was wondering why “God” would be sitting around hoping I give him a piece of pie? I mean Jesus says our brother in need is where we see Him, so it seems the guy should have been giving a slice to a brother or sister who was in need. But nobody like that was in the video at all.
ncatina reply on August 26th, 2008 at 6:24 am :
Very interesting video. Great summation of the guilt trip played on people regarding warped giving.
rascoe1 reply on August 26th, 2008 at 5:20 pm :
How much lower will they go? I wonder whats next.