Rekjalhew

November 27, 2007

Arab Muslims Continue Buying Up America. Citigroup Makes Abu Dhabi one of its Largest Shareholders.

by @ 12:03 am. Filed under Business

Just little big stakes in US companies now and take the rest later.

Citi Sells Stake to Abu Dhabi Fund

NEW YORK (AP) — Citigroup said late Monday that the Abu Dhabi Investment Authority will invest $7.5 billion in the nation’s largest bank, offering needed capital to offset big losses from mortgages and other investments.

The cash from the sovereign investment fund of the Gulf Arab state, which has been a beneficiary of this year’s surge in oil prices, will be convertible into no more than 4.9 percent of Citigroup Inc.’s equity. Citigroup characterized the investment as passive and said the fund will not be able to name any board members to the bank.

The Investment Authority would become one of Citi’s largest shareholders.

Dubai International Capital, which is owned by the ruler of that booming Persian Gulf city-state, announced earlier Monday that it has acquired a stake of undisclosed size in the Japanese electronics and media company Sony Corp. Its other investments this year included acquiring a 3.12 percent of European Aeronautic Defence & Space Co., which builds Airbus commercial planes and military aircraft. The firm also holds stakes in Daimler AG and British bank HSBC Holdings PLC.

Many companies have welcomed such investments because the funds tend to be stable investors, but some U.S. officials have expressed concern that their acquisitions could target sensitive industries with links to national security.

Abu Dhabi’s move recalls the early 1990s investment in Citi made by Saudi Prince Alwaleed bin Talal. After Citi made some losing bets on U.S. real estate and Latin America, Alwaleed bought a stake in the bank for less than $600 million that has since ballooned into several billions of dollars.

So the banks gave money to people who really had terrible credit to begin with, back when Liberals cried that banks need to give out more loans. Then it all comes back to bite and the banks sell stakes to Arab Muslim nations. The unspoken truth is that Mexico has leverage over America because of outstanding bank deals, that could go belly up if America ever did something like close the southern border to illegal entry. How much leverage will Arabs have in the future, when some future President feels a need to go after a terrorist king pin in an Arab nation after a major terrorist attack?

American sovereignty slipping away daily…

And how do the Arabs get the money to buy up America? The oil. I still think America needs to work harder on clean liquid coal.



43 Responses to “Arab Muslims Continue Buying Up America. Citigroup Makes Abu Dhabi one of its Largest Shareholders.”

  1. KyleAndrews Says:

    IC,

    I want to be frank with you.  You know I’m a straight shooter as you know me from the other blogs we post to.  Listen.  Our dollar is decreasing in value because of our Federal Reserve is printing money like a banana republic.  Also, every year we run a budget deficit.  So the question begs the answer.  If we run a deficit every year where did we get the money from?  Answer- From other countries.  Because we are in DEEP debt to these other countries we can either pay them off OR they can "buy" our assets.  They do this by having something called a sovereign wealth fund.  Think of it like a bank IC.  If you can’t pay your mortgage than the bank takes your house.  IC we can’t pay our debts.  We are running a 9 trillion dollar debt.  The countries who we owe money to are buying our country.  This is niether a Democrat nor a Republican issue.  The fact is we have no choice but to give away vast portions of our country to satisfy our debts.  You WILL continue to see this.  There is no way out.  Our country is financially bankrupt.

    Kyle 

  2. KyleAndrews Says:

    IC, I needed to expound upon this further. Everything I am saying is true and verifiable. Let me start from the beginning as the why and how we came to this point…………………… In 1913 under Woodrow Wilson’s administration the President signed into legislation the federal Reserve Act allowing a cartel of banks to print and control our money supply Prior to this our Govt. printed our money. Since then a cartel of banks which is neither “federal” nor is it a “reserve” now prints and controls our money. The Federal Reserve is NOT controlled by our Govt. but is like I said a group of international bankers which print our money at various locations in the US. What may shock you even more is that we have to “BUY” this money from the banks. Yes you heard me. We buy the money at material and labor cost YET have to pay interest on the total amount. You heard me correct. Let me give you an example. Lets say it costs a $1000 in paper, ink, wages, etc to “print” a Billion dollars. WE have to PAY the Fed the grand for the billion. However, on top of that we pay interest on the BILLION. YEP! This is one reason why we run up a debt. We have a debt we owe to bankers who print our money. Moving on. During WWII we needed extra cash for the war effort. Then President Roosevelt took us partially off the gold standard. The reason for this was because the only constraint that the fed had was that they couldn’t print more money than what the value of gold we had on hand. With the constraints loosened the fed now could print even more money which as you know WE had to pay interest on. Moving even further. In the 1970s Nixon decided to take us off the gold standard COMPLETELY thus allowing the Fed as much fiat money to be created as we needed. With the staggering increase in printed money backed by nothing our dollar began to become weaker and weaker. Instead of trimming back on spending our Govt. kept having larger and larger budgets each year and the Fed was more than happy to “print” us more. So now not only did we owe the Fed money but since we started borrowing money from other countries we now owe them. However, since our dollar is garbage( Just look compared to the Euro) countries who hold our notes don’t want money back because what they will get back will be less than what they lent it to us. So instead they will take hard assets like investments into our companies. Like I said IC our deficit is at 9 trillion right now. And guess what. That doesn’t include TOTAL unfunded liabilities. When we take Social Security in the equation we are in debt 40 TRILLION dollars. IC, we are going to do two things. #1. Continue to allow countries to take our assets as we can’t pay them back. #2. Call our currency and create a new currency “Amero” in the near future. Everything I said was true and verifiable. 

    Kyle

  3. IndependentConservative Says:

    Well I’m sure with option #2 that includes the North American Union.  Rough waters ahead either way.

  4. KyleAndrews Says:

    The Amero

    http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=58877

    Sovereign Wealth Funds

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sovereign_wealth_funds

    Truth About Federal Reserve

    http://www.tysknews.com/Depts/Taxes/fed_banking_fraud.htm

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=ji_G0MqAqq8&feature=related

    Kyle

  5. KyleAndrews Says:

    IC,

    Read "just" the title of this article and "Just" the first line of the article and you will see exactly what I said is true.   This is quite disturbing.

     http://dailybriefing.blogs.fortune.cnn.com/category/sovereign-wealth/

    Kyle

  6. IndependentConservative Says:

    Well you’ve certainly helped explain it all, thank you Kyle.

  7. KyleNYC Says:

    IC,

    Everything Kyle’s been saying is true and not because he has the same name as me :-).  All of what he’s saying is historical fact and it’s all part of the big set up.  Which is why the current credit crisis was allowed to happen.  If you create the problem, you can "create" the solution.  The solution being…Rev. 13

    Anywhoz, the devil is in the details in this deal.  Not only will they be getting Citi stock (preferred or common, I can’t remember), but they are lending the money at ELEVEN PERCENT INTEREST!!!  ELEVEN PERCENT!!!  Now you know why they’re going to be laying off close to another 17,000 people in the next couple o’ months!!!
    http://www.cnbc.com/id/21976331/

    Sorry for the shouting and the "sloppy links" (I’m rushing), but next year you will see some real "bloodshed" in the markets.
    http://www.cnbc.com/id/21986446

    BTW, did anyone catch Paula White on Larry King last night?  If so, did the phrase "synergistic triune beings" in reference to us humans cause your jaw to drop into the earth’s core?  If you didn’t catch it, check YouTube and go 25:00 in (real time with commercials) or the third segment to see what I mean.

    Shocking.

  8. IndependentConservative Says:

    Well it’s good you "Kyles" are here :) .

    Regarding the type of stock, the WSJ article that I didn’t want to use because of registration requirements to read it in full notes this:

    In exchange for its investment, ADIA will receive convertible stock in Citigroup yielding 11% annually. The shares are required to be converted into common stock at a conversion price of between $31.83 and $37.24 a share over a period of time between March 2010 and September 2011. The investment, which came together in about a week, is expected to close within the next several days.

    Citi is paying a higher interest rate than companies that borrow on the high-yield, or junk-bond, market; currently they pay roughly 9% for straight bonds. Typically, convertible bonds pay lower interest rates than straight bonds, although a particular bond’s structure could affect the interest rate paid.

    Don’t worry, they’ll get the good stuff in time with that 11% interest rate! (sarcasm, but true)

    I did see Paula White last night.  I did see her claim we humans are "synergistic triune beings".  Yes my jaw dropped.  I also saw her telling Larry King that her book could help him in ways other than finding Christ, after Larry made sure to tell her he is an "unbeliever".  And Paula went right into gospel of YOU garbage with nothing to say about the book glorifying Christ, because it’s all about Y-O-U you know?  It’s really not about God’s glory in her world, but your glory.  I’ve got the video.  Depending on how things go I’ll get footage to YouTube.

    She was so terrible, Larry didn’t even have to bother with THE QUESTION.  She claims she’s trying to be like "Christ", but the FALSE "christ" she follows is happy to have Donald Trump lauding her book right there on the cover or inside flap!

  9. KyleAndrews Says:

    KyleNYC,

    Thanks man.  once I did the research about the Federal Reserve, Money Supply, and SWF My jaw dropped.  The truth is one so obscene that if you tell them these things people think your not only lying but you are a conspiracy theorist.  You know your Paul Revere but everyone looks at you like your Chicken Little.  What amazes me is that our GDP is around 13 trillion (Assets) but our total unfunded liabilities are 40 trillion.  OMG! We are bankrupt.  So lets get the auctioneer to sell off America to cover our debts.

    Kyle

  10. healtheland Says:

    IC: To be fair, lots of preachers claim that we are made in God’s image because like He is Father, Son, and Holy Spirit we are mind, body, and spirit. I used to say it myself until I realized that upon His Incarnation Jesus Christ had a mind, body, and spirit also.  The only thing new that Paula White is pushing, then, is incorporating the word "synergy" into it. But I got a mailing from Joyce Meyer last year (yes, I only recently stopped watching her and sending her money :-8 ) where she claimed that the word to describe the next phase of HER ministry was "synergy." I keep telling you man, these folks get together and plan this stuff.

    Anyway: "… So the banks gave money to people who really had terrible credit to begin with, back when Liberals cried that banks need to give out more loans. " they won’t talk about this much, but I was listening to talk radio a few years ago, and even though it wasn’t the spin that THEY put on it this was what I figured out … the root cause of this stuff was "the Clinton economy." September 11th and the issues in the energy sector (which the media STILL refuses to adequately address … it is amazing that the price of gas has tripled in four years and the media rarely talks about it!) have played their roles, of course, but the root cause was this dot – com sham. Egged on by the Clinton administration and the media, all of these big banks, big mutual funds, pension funds, etc. put hundreds of billions of dollars into a bunch of companies that aren’t around anymore. Priceline, Expedia, Amazon.com, Ebay … you think about it those are pretty much the only ones still around. That put the banks in a real bind. Soooo … they started giving out mortgages right and left because they needed the down payments to stay in business. The folks on the radio show talked about how they were giving people with bad credit and no stable employment history $300,000 mortgages just to get the $5,000 out of them, and more to the point giving people who actually were on solid financial footing much larger loans than they should have qualified in order to get the $10,000 out of them. They were also pushing the ARMs so the people would give all their savings up front and were looking at what was INITIALLY a small monthly payment. In other words, they started using the same tactics with middle class and upper class clients that predatory lenders have been using on lower income and elderly people for decades. All because they needed to get their hands on as much cash as possible as quickly as possible. No one in the media wants to talk about how "the Clinton economy" was nothing but a harmful sham, and how they egged it on by encouraging everyone to go invest their life savings in Pets.com. Of course, the conservatives were no better (by this I mean the neocons, the paleocons were always skeptical of leftist college dropouts who were ranting about how they were going to change the world). I still remember all of those Wall Street Journal and National Review "investor class" columns. Ugh. Turns out that Bill Clinton and Newt Gingrich worked together to pass a bunch of laws to make that huge scam possible. But that is Council on Foreign Relations conspiracy stuff that folks like me and Kyle keep up with so I will stop right there :-)

  11. KyleNYC Says:

    Kyle,

    (wow that seems odd, I feel like I’m writing to myself)
    I’ve been following the CFR/TC/ NWO/Alphabet Oligarchy connection for years. You’ve probably heard of Danny Casolaro who started doing research on the "Grand Cabal" as Winston Churchill put it, andwasthisclose to connecting ALL of the dots until he, ahem, killed hisself under the most curious of circumstances…and in several different ways
    Yeah, you read that right.
    He called it "The Octopus" and discovered that "it" reaches into everything. Having said all that, I’ll say this: when Revelation 13 "goes down", it’s going down in several million different flavors from several million different angles, primarily through finance. You can’t grow your own food anymore because the seeds have been genetically modified; you can’t get your own water because anyone living in a big city is supplied by the municipality and even if you live out in the boonies some conglomerate years ago contaminated the water table rendering it useless for eons.  You will need the "mark" if you’re going to to survive.  This whole sub-prime mess, which really gets rockin’ in 2Q/3Q 2008 because of all of the 2/5 ARMS that are set to "break" at that time, will be one of the major conduits to decreasing financial privacy. Sure the Hedge Funds will squeal, but Dems like pork, and they strip the fat off the biggest pigs first before they come for YOU. This is one of the way the oligarchy works and speaking of the oligarchy, they’ve already decided who the next president is and her name is (Lord God, I hope I’m wrong) Hillary. Read "VoteScam" by James & Kenneth Collier. It will open your eyes.

  12. IndependentConservative Says:

    HealtheLand, regarding her "triune" comment, once I have video up, we’ll let you decide for yourself.  Plenty of us know how some put it and that’s not how it came off when Paula said it.

    Really we are body and spirit.  Our minds are part of that thing called "flesh" and once saved we submit to allowing the Lord to use our entire bodies, mind included for His ministry, praise and glory.  So that our spirit goes with Him upon death and our bodies later renewed.  When we die we are just spirit, the mind is part of our body, all the body is asleep till renewed at the resurrection.  We do have a spirit of the mind, Ephesians 4:23, but mind is of the flesh and a part of the body.  I could say I’m heart, body and spirit, but that’s just as flawed a statement, we are body and spirit.  Given the "heart" claim I could toss in, I could go further and say I’m heart, mind, body and spirit, see how crazy it gets?  We are body and spirit.  Yes the processing goes on in our minds and there is a spirit that lives on after death, yes we have feelings, but the mind and heart are of the flesh.  We seek for Christ to renew us, all of us.  I just don’t find that "body, soul, spirit" claim tossed around in scripture from what I’ve seen, but if I’m wrong let me know.  It just seems like modern Christendom has tried to develop a triune definition for man, to add to that "little gods" effort.

    If you’ve been watching some of Joyce in the recent past, we need a blogger to break down her tactics for everyone.  Hopefully you’re the man for the job, since it seems not many bloggers mention her (in detail) and I never watched the woman any longer than it took to press the button to change the channel.

    I think you guys are giving good financial analysis of things.  I really appreciate it, I think many of us are learning more.  Clinton and Newt worked together and brought about things like more trade with China.

  13. IndependentConservative Says:

    and even if you live out in the boonies some conglomerate years ago contaminated the water table rendering it useless for eons.


    KyleNYC – You being up north there, you don’t know much about well water that some people down here in the south still use.  (And I’m not talking about some big hole in a field with a circular rock wall around it and a bucket in the middle, but something more sophisticated yet similar, to run water throughout a home just like any piped water system.)  If you dig in most back yards in areas with enough land (you do need a good bit of land to be sure this works for you) you can hit a table of water underground and many people live off that.  It’s their own water right under their homes.  So it’s not contaminated, unless someone comes to their property or very close, to tamper with it.  And everyone I’ve known on well water exercises their 2nd amendment rights to the full!  (They are in rural areas and can’t even consider doing like city slickers, who call the cops to bring over guns and play a government sponsored hired gunman role, they’ve got to do it themselves if a criminal comes their way!  I still can’t figure out the Christian who refuses to own a gun because they "claim" they’re being more Christian by not owning one, yet will call cops over who they know bring guns when they have a problem.  If you can’t shoot or can’t control yourself or others around firearms that’s one thing, but it’s bogus to act like not owning a gun is holier than having one.) 

  14. KyleNYC Says:

    IC,

    Ssshhh!!!  I’m a city boy now living in the boonies with 3.5 acres!  IBM and another company up here in Dutchess County had been contaminating the water table for years, if not decades.   By the grace of God however, my water supply has been tainted…yet.

  15. KyleNYC Says:

    healtheland,
    I beg to (cordially) differ. Let me go out on a limb and suggest that instead of calling it a "plan" on their part, can we entertain the idea that they are (caution: inflammatory language coming) SATANICALLY INSPIRED just as Christians are DIVINELY inspired? When I heard Mizz White say that she is a "synergistic triune being" I knew EXACTLY what she was getting at. Just as Satan did to Eve in the Garden, so is he doing to folks here in the end times: getting them to believe the powerful delusion that they are, or can be, <u>g</u>ods (little "g" underlined for emphasis). And using a quasi-innocuous spokesperson like Mizz White, with her rags-to-riches sob story to get that message out, in conjunction with the Jakes’, the Osteens and TBN makes it more palatable. OK, maybe not TBN.
    But you know what strikes me the most about all of this? The lug nuts who swallow it hook, line and sinker. From the 10,000 plus sheeple at "Smiling Boy’s" gathering every Sunday who go their primarily to get their spiritual endorphin "hit" to the talking heads on the business channels touting the health of stocks and the economy even though the arc of their perilous swan dives are starting to steepen towards a fatal angle. All of these folks should know better, but no, they defer to the "experts" who with their alphabet credentials, purposeful and deliberate speaking patterns and seemingly irrefutable evidence, anecdotes and charts that deceive people.
    Check out this excerpt from this week’s <a href="" mod="b_hpp_9_0002_b_this_weeks_magazine_home_left">Barrons</a>:

    Stock Boosters Still Rule the Street
    After the DOT-COM Bubble popped, many Wall Street analysts were exposed as cheerleaders, willing at times to tout stocks they secretly disdained. And the subsequent billions of dollars in fines, tighter regulation and public embarrassment don’t seem to have dampened their bullish views of the companies they track.
    That was what Barron’s found in its update of a comprehensive review of sell-side –or brokerage-conducted –research covering November 1993 through December 2002, by professors Ulrike Malmendier of the University of California at Berkeley and Devin Shanthikumar of Harvard Business School.
    Their study, entitled "Are Small Investors Naive About Incentives?" (Journal of Financial Economics, August 2007), reported that sell-side analysts gave neutral-to-positive ratings 95.4% of the time. In other words, the sell side recommended that a stock be sold only 4.6% of the time.

    Or, in my words, for the right price, Wall Street will tout anything. And it seems like, for the right price, the devil has gotten Mizz White to promote the lie.

  16. KyleNYC Says:

    ooops.  sorry for the HTML carnage.  first day with the new brains.

  17. art123 Says:

    Maybe I should learn the Arab language, starting now.  Salaam-Salaakim.  Is that how it goes?  America’s economics is slowing slipping away for sure.

  18. Caleb Phillips Says:

    Yes, I do have to agree, art123. The government may as well up a sign in front of the Capitol Building saying "America for Sale by Owners."

  19. KyleAndrews Says:

    @ KyleNYC,

    I actually live in Upstate NY.  I like the fact that you are Knowledgeable about this stuff. What is more frightening is the response by Wall Street today. The stock market went up nearly 200 points on the news that Abu Dhabi bailed out Citi Financial. Why? Simple. The stock market does not have any allegiance to America. The stockholders would not have cared if Iran or North Korea bailed us out. It’s all about the bottom line. What is more frightening is the fact that the Fed may actually cut interest rates even further thus inflating the money supply even more resulting in higher fuel and food prices. Haven’t you ever wondered why food prices have been skyrocketing? It’s because it’s a direct reflection of inflation. Ironically the Fed does not consider FOOD or ENERGY in the equation for inflation. This is why they can lie to you to your face and say inflation is low. Want to know another thing. By under reporting inflation this gives employers the opportunity to give you crappy raises. This is why wages have been stagnant for over a decade yet prices are screaming higher. Hey! You want a prediction. Countrywide Financial is the largest mortgage company out there. They are like the GM of mortgage companies. They too will have to come up with billions. And you know what? Expect a nice Arab or Chinese firm to “help” them out. Mark my word IC when you hear about Countrywide in dire straits expect a little help from our “friends” in the world to help us out. Are you ready for some real conspiracy theory. This is all planned by the globalist. They will bring the world to it’s knees for the sake of global socialism bringing the Antichrist to power.
    P.S. Remember to watch Coast to Coast am this Wed night. Pat Buchanan will be on discussing the end of America.
    Kyle

  20. JJ Says:

    A lot of knowlege on this board. So what in your respective opinions should a North American believer be doing at this time? Just trying to get out of personal debt, maybe?
    Blessings,
    JJ

  21. healtheland Says:

    IC:

    Well, the tactics of Joyce Meyer are pretty much the same of Paula White. The only real difference is that the Meyers are smarter and target a different audience.

    KyleNYC: I have no problem with the satanically inspired thing. However, I also know that these folks coordinate with each other. There is DEFINITELY collusion going on with these people, who are in a business just like anybody else. The thing is that I am not certain that their collusion is illegal.

  22. art123 Says:

    Meyers is older and more experienced at what she does.  IC, I have a question.  You were discussing body and mind to Healtheland.  Is there a such thing as a out of body experience.  I noticed people who’s been in near death accidents talk about it, especially on tv.  What do you have to say about it?

  23. IndependentConservative Says:

    KyleAndrews – I think KyleNYC is it correct when he notes that the force behind all of this is not an organized human entity, but rather God allowing Satan to carry out what will involve the Antichrist.  In the end we will see the fullness of victory in Christ and God glorified, it’s all for God’s glory.

    Coast to Coast?  Ah, lets just say I prefer not to look to sources that speak of space aliens one night and global politics the next :) .  I’m not saying they are always off point, but you know I’m not of the Art Bell wing ;) .

    JJ – Your focus should be on being a Christian and following Christ, not locking yourself to patriotism, ask the Lord for wisdom and He will give it to you James 1:5.  With your finances, you have no clue what will happen, just see to it that you express and recognize that if the Lord wills via your efforts you might come out of debt, James 4:13-17.  You have to focus yourself on contentment.  The apostles never promised debt slaves a windfall of money to one day have physical freedom.  Your joy is in Christ and Him alone,  not the material cares of this world.  You work to be a good steward, but accept your earthly financial status as the Lord wills. 

    This all is disturbing information for those who don’t know Christ.  For we who know Him, we know that God’s plan will work to completion for His glory and our job is to remain focused on Him and He will grant us eternal life once we’re beyond this current life.

    HealtheLand – You know those who are able to collude have influence in this world for their actions to be deemed legal by the laws of man.  Don’t let it trouble you.  James 5 notes their ways and our commitment to be patient.  Also see Psalm 10.

    Art123, regarding Out of Body Experiences (OBEs), of course there is the account in 2 Corinthians 12, but was that an OBE or an IBE (in body experience), we do not know :D .  Keep in mind, that nobody sees hell and comes back to tell about it, Luke 16.  Those who lift up their eyes in hell don’t get a return ticket!  Flee all who tell you they’ve seen hell. 

    I have a family member who was physically dead so long that doctors gave up on her.  We were in a nearby waiting room praying and sitting humble yet somber, while the doctors worked.  We had no clue she died when it occurred, although we knew she was very near death and praying she might be allowed to remain with us a while longer.  Well like I said, she died, but after the doctors turned off their equipment and were ready to have her placed in a body bag, she came back.  She is very much a believer on Christ.  She had what is often called the "bright light" experience.  She even told us she saw herself outside of the body and the doctors giving up on her.  She said she was heading towards a very bright light, then brought back into her body.  She does not speak of it often, because she does not want people to think she’s nuts.  She’s only told we who are close relatives and believers.

    The doctor told her she was gone for so long, that she’d experience memory loss.  It did not happen immediately, but has begun to occur as the doctor said it would.  From her being clinically brain dead for so many minutes.

    Did she have some mental experience that never actually involved her soul leaving her body?  I do not know.  Was the light she saw some recesses of light from her eyes in her brain or really a trip towards Heaven?  I do not know.  What we know is that we are thankful the Lord’s will is always done and for now He has willed that she is still with us and even if she left she’d be victorious with eternal life.  The person who had that experience does not make that their foundation for faith and neither do we.  We hold to the head which is Christ and not visions, as is instructed in Colossians 2:18-19.  This is why I shun those who try and play up visions as something I must embrace, because I hold to Christ and build my faith based on the Word of God, scripture.  Scripture speaks of Christ and is the sure word, 2 Peter 1:19-21.  So I’m holding to Christ and will stick with the best resource available, which is scripture, allowing the Holy Spirit to lead.

  24. KyleNYC Says:

    Kyle,You live upstate?!?!? What? Where? In my basement? :-)Seriously though, I was at a free "Stock Market" seminar this morning and the speaker got to talking about the economy and he touched a little on real estate.  (I’d love to tell you who it was, but some of his comments were "off the record").  His take on the Citi deal is that ANY entity that has to borrow money at ELEVEN PERCENT, with today’s historically low rates is desperate and should be considered junk.  He also considered the rate "usury", which is interesting considering that Dubai, and I could be wrong, is a Muslim nation.  Small wonder then that Bank Of America (hmmm) wants to merge with them, primarily because of the customer base, but also because of any LIQUID and/or performing assets that they might be able to scavenge. The Countrywide Mortgage company issue was also brought up briefly and he confirmed what I’ve been feeling ever since they got a cash infusion from Bank Of America (hmmm, again) which is that Countrywide is probably on it’s last legs and futilely sucking wind, even though it’s more like a "death rattle". And I have my mortgage with them!As for Coast to Coast, I used to listen to it when Art Bell was the regular host but when I got suckered by Gary North over the whole Y2K scare I decided to be a little more discerning. And no, I’m not going to talk about it! :-)I will say this though: keep your eyes on the skies………

    JJ,As far as debt is concerned, please get out of debt. Debt, in general, is a bad thing, because it means less money in your pocket and less money for your future. But, debt can be a good thing if you are properly leveraged, i.e., you have invested in real estate with healthy reversionary values which is what the smart ones do. They buy a semi-healthy building with 8, 10, 12 apartments, fix it up to a level that legally allows them to increase rents to a market level and then get it reappraised to reflect the new investment worthy value. Notice I didn’t say income generating and that’s because income generating versus investment worthy are separated by two things: expenses and debt service. Any building can generate income, but it’s how much income is left after the bills have been paid that make it investment worthy to another investor. Most investors don’t hold onto these buildings forever, but instead, hold it for a period of five, ten, fifteen years, let it appreciate and then sell when the reversionary value has met their goal(s). The proper term here for investment worthy value here is "After Tax Cash Flow", but I don’t want to get to technical and besides, I’m looking to sucker some people into buying my "midnight infomercial" titled "How to Make Money in Real Estate By Getting People to Buy Systems That, If They Really Worked, I Wouldn’t Dare Tell Anybody About Them, But Instead I Would Make All the Money and Corner the Market". It’s a work in progress.With that new "equity"(which technically, you could say was pulled out of the air, more on Federal Reserve "dollars" later) they then borrow against the old/new building to buy yet another one. I’m a Commercial Real Estate Appraiser here in NYC and I’ve seen it done time and time again. Even the smaller, four unit buildings have some pretty nice returns. But it’s not going to last forever. Can you say irrational exuberance, anyone? When the credit markets really tighten up next year, you don’t want to be in a position to have to borrow from one to pay another which is really what’s going to hammer A LOT of people next year. Plus, if you have some extra cash on hand, you may be able to scoop up the aforementioned investment property at a pretty nice discount.

    healtheland,I agree that there is probably some collusion going on behind the scenes. I’m no remote viewer (wink, wink, Kyle) but I’m pretty sure they’re communicating with each other on some level in some way, e.g., phone, email, carrier pigeon, Cessna Citation X. I just wouldn’t put it past the devil to "give them a word" that they can then claim is from "God", the proof of which is everyone else is preaching it!

  25. art123 Says:

    IC, you explained the Arabs leverage over America is because of the oil and that the future president can destroy that if he or she goes after the terrorist.  What is the purpose now for this war?  Is it to keep the American people off their backs because of the 911 incident?

  26. IndependentConservative Says:

    art123 – I was saying that a future president would have added difficulty if they go after a terrorist, because Arabs keep holding more of America.  Not that a future president going after a terrorist would end what is already in process.

    The real purpose of going into Iraq was to establish a US military presence in that region for future strikes, period.  That’s the real reason.  And yes for those who know of PNAC, you know that was the plan.

    And Saddam gave enough reasons to justify the goal.

    Honestly, given how the Saudi’s use their oil money to back all kinds of terrible things, that lead to and include terrorism, I would not object of our government decided to take all the oil in Saudi (if they could) and did it as confiscation of a terrorist asset, but that’s just my opinion :D .  And besides, we know our government loves the Saudis too much to ever consider something like that.  Because our government officials are making good money for themselves with things as they are now.  They’ve got no motivation to upset the pot.

  27. art123 Says:

    There’s a comment I want to make.  Maybe America and Mexico has some secret deal going on, considering you claimed that Mexico has leverage right now because of their banks.  That deal could be include not securing the borders and may I add, nowadays it has been hard for Americans to find jobs.  I wonder why.  No disrespect at all but I do see it like this:  If you remember history, Mexico once had possession of Texas until Sam Houston and his army defeated Mexico and took it over.  Remember the Alamo?  I am thinking that America is reaping what they’re sowing.  They did steal this land from the Indians.  This is how I’m viewing it right now but does it make me right?  Only God knows.

  28. IndependentConservative Says:

    I remember the Alamo and Mexico won that round and took the Alamo back, but had to give it up again later.  The "remember the Alamo" phrase is in regards to remembering the loss and how many were slaughtered when Mexico got the Alamo back.  Remember how Mexico won and killed Texans is what "remember the Alamo" is all about.

    Be careful not to apply scripture directed towards Israel’s land covenant to other nations, especially outside of the old covenant.  I’m not going to get into the list, but even what you claim is "Mexico" was a product of invasion and even before that the people claimed to be "natives" were having blood baths of their own to possess the land before that.  Also much of what is America was purchased from other groups that stole it earlier.  Also see: Reconquista Debunked!  If it’s a matter of God setting the affairs of unregenerate men straight before the return of Christ, no nation would exists.  When it comes to national affairs, all we know is what is in scripture and that’s all.  No, just because nation A takes from nation or people group B, it does NOT mean that nation A will suffer long after the people who took from nation or people group B are all long dead and hundreds of years have past.  That is very old covenant.  Christ breaks old curses for those who love him.  God is not bound to avenge the defeat of some group that was unregenerate to begin with.  God is not bound to avenge me in this life if my own home were overrun by unregenerate people.  Christ will judge in the end, but with current affairs we can’t assume that because A did B wrong that A will suffer or their children will suffer in a material form in this life.  Do we reap what we sow, yes, but that is as individuals and the reaping really comes after this life, not during it.

    In this life, when it comes to everything, including affairs of nations, it is the will of God alone.
    Romans 13:1 (New American Standard Bible)

    1 Every person is to be in subjection to the governing authorities For there is no authority except from God, and those which exist are established by God.

    All people groups are in their current position because of God’s sovereign plan, that will work for His glory.
    Acts 17:26 (New American Standard Bible)

    26 and He made from one man every nation of mankind to live on all the face of the earth, having determined their appointed times and the boundaries of their habitation,

    Will those who forsook Christ and did bad things have to answer for their actions, yes.  But God has already informed us that HIS PLAN includes allowing the Anti-Christ to rule this planet with only the Lord’s return putting an end to it all.  So the bottom line is, don’t assume anything other than what is in scripture.

  29. art123 Says:

    IC, I am going to have to re-read the history of the Alamo.  Perhaps, I may have missed something because I thought that America won that war.  I don’t recall reading about the slaughter but I’ll look it up.

  30. art123 Says:

    IC, you’re probably picking at me right now.  You’re probably saying that she fell asleep in history class.  I’ll look it up.

  31. IndependentConservative Says:

    art123 – No, you did not fall asleep in history class.  The common perception is that we say "remember the Alamo" because Texas (not America, but you can look that up too) won, when they lost and it’s a remembrance of the loss, because they never wanted to lose again.  In these times nobody wants to think anything associated today with America could have ever lost and I think that’s how the misconception and total misrepresentation of history on the Alamo started.
    Battle of the Alamo

    The Battle of the Alamo was a 19th-century battle between the Republic of Mexico and the rebel Texian forces, including both Anglos (ethnic Europeans) and Tejanos (ethnic Mexicans in Texas), during the Texians’ fight for independence — the Texas Revolution. It took place at the Alamo Mission in San Antonio, Texas (then known as "San Antonio de Béxar") in February and March 1836. The 13-day siege started Tuesday, February 23, 1836, and ended on Sunday, March 6, 1836, with the capture of the mission and the death of nearly all the Texian and Tejano defenders, except for a few slaves, women and children. Despite the win, the 13-day holdout stalled the Mexican Army’s progress and allowed Sam Houston to gather troops and supplies for his later success at the Battle of San Jacinto. The Texian revolutionaries went on to win the war.

    That page does not appear to mention that the last of the Texas men of that fight (the slaves had already run away when the fight got thick and they had an opportunity to flee) were rounded up and killed execution style.

  32. art123 Says:

    I read and see what you mean about the slaughter.  The Texas were attacked from four corners of the Alamo by the Mexicans, but the Texans later won the war.  IC, I have one more question which is about America and its economy.  I’ve been hearing and was taught that when you read Revelations 18, Babylon the Great is referring to America and that it is fulfilling prophecy.  What’s your take on this?

  33. Copeland8 Says:

    I did fall asleep in history class and the information in this thread has taught me a lot. Still confused about the economic talk though (I always hated economics), but I do want to learn more

    Thanks to everyone who has made a post

  34. IndependentConservative Says:

    @32 – I’m just going to say that many have applied eisegesis to passages of scripture they really don’t know the answer to.  What if America becomes a poor weak nation?  What will they say then?  Is it one nation?  Global?  For now I’ll say little.  Just keep studying for yourself and praying for the Holy Spirit to lead you in all truth.

  35. KyleAndrews Says:

    Click on these links…….

    We are slowly destroying our currency on purpose so we can "call" our currency for a new one the Amero.  Here are two clips from highly respected conservatives.  You must realize that what you are seeing is the deliberate destruction of our economy by S.W.F as we discussed, Overprinting of our money, and transnationalism.

    http://ianschwartz.com/2007/10/11/video-corsi-talks-about-the-amero/

    http://ianschwartz.com/2007/10/25/video-corsi-on-the-threat-of-a-north-american-currency/

    Kyle

  36. art123 Says:

    In response to the video about the amero, in that case you can say that it is all business, nothing personal about this sinking economy.   K. Andrews, can you explain what NAFTA is?  It was mentioned.  To comment on your comment #2, when I was a NYC resident, when you go in the Wall Street area or even Midtown, you would see international banks around, the Asian banks, Europeans, Latin America, and more.  Therefore, I believe this supports what you were saying.

  37. art123 Says:

    To add, I used to wonder why there were foreign banks set up in the USA.  Also to note, some of you may have heard about Bank of America hiring illegal aliens this year.  This country gets stranger by the day.

  38. IndependentConservative Says:

    Art123, you can read this for more information.

    NAFTA = North America Free Trade Agreement
    CAFTA = Central America Free Trade Agreement

    Who pressed till he got his way with these?  BILL CLINTON!!!  And look, now his wife wants to be President.  But it really does not matter who wins.  The sled is pointed downhill and the grease already in place.  As you can see from the link above, Bush is doing his part to put jet rocket boosters on the sled and the next President regardless of who wins will add nitrous oxide to the fuel used in those rocket boosters.

  39. KyleAndrews Says:

    Here is a link that summarizes what NAFTA is.

    http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-nafta.htm

    Like IC said it does not matter who wins the Presidency in 08.  Both Republicans and Democrats are on the same page when it comes to globalism.  Don’t think for a moment that Democrats are for the little guy.  Also, don’t think that Republicans really want to keep taxes low to spur growth for the middle class.  Initial results from the tax cuts have shown a massive shift of wealth from the middle class to the wealthy.  Back to the Fed Reserve.  By inflating the money supply the Govt. puts a tax on you.  WHAT!  What do you mean Kyle?  Glad you asked.  Let me explain.  As you have noticed Food and energy prices have been skyrocketing in recent years.  These things are commodities.  They are readily consumed and are subjest to major swings in price.  However, the two things that most people use the most are energy and food.  Think about it.  You eat every day and drive your car, heat your home, run electricity.  So with the Fed pumping money into the system and weakening the dollar they have created inflation.  Inflation is the rise in prices.  So lets say for simplicity sake lets say the sales tax is 5%.  So far so good.  Lets say that the cost of a particular item is $1.00.  Common sense the total amount comes to $1.05 with tax.  Lets say the same good now cost $2.00 5 years later.  At 5% tax the total amount comes to $2.10.  Notice the tax increase?  The Govt. now received .10 cents on your transaction instead of .05 cents all the while lying to your face that taxes have not gone up.  You can expect the Fed to keep pumping money into the system so the Govt. can pay off their debts with weak dollars which is foisted upon you and I in terms of higher prices and higher taxes.   You see at least the Dems are honest and tell you to your face they will raise your taxes.  The Republicans just like to do it by borrowing and putting it on the national credit card for you and I to pay later.  Unfortunately later is now and the chickens are coming home to roost.  One last thing.  There is something called the M3.  The M3 is a term used for the entire money in the money supply.  In 2006 the Fed no longer published the M3.  In simpler terms the Fed now refuses to let anybody know how much US dollars are out there.  Why?  Because if they did you would see such a dollar meltdown and massive inflation not seen since the 1970s.  So what they are doing instead is hiding the truth which is now slowly coming to a head.  Stagflation anyone. 

    http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article2922.html

    Kyle

  40. KyleAndrews Says:

    Want to talk about manipulation.  We have all heard the wonderful report on how well the Black Friday weekend went.  We heard that sales were up.  Likewise the stock Market zoomed up on the "good" news.  Well, come tofind out sales were only up because of steep discounts to lure shoppers into the store.  The reality is that its not sales that is important but rather profit.  The fact of the matter is stores have been relying on little to no margin.  I mean really, who wants to sell lots of stuff at 0 profit.  Be prepared for the real eye opener when January and February comes around and the stores have to discount all thier goods BELOW a profit after a season with little to no profit.  The signs are all pointing to a major recession in 2008.  My suggestion would be to try and get out of debt as much as possible.  However, in the interum expect the Fed to try to keep the lie going as long as they can before the next presidential election.  After that all bets are off.

    The Christmas season lie.

    http://money.cnn.com/2007/11/29/news/companies/holidaywinners_losers/index.htm?postversion=2007112909

    Kyle

  41. KyleAndrews Says:

    Here is the definitive article on what is happening.  This article explains it all and is only the tip of the iceberg.  In other words the vultures are flying over the carcass called America and are ready to eat us alive even more.  Happy reading!

    http://money.cnn.com/2007/11/28/magazines/fortune/sovereignwealth_1129.fortune/index.htm

    Kyle

  42. art123 Says:

    IC, to comment on #26, I read on another website that not only America loves the Arabs for their oil, especially in Saudi Arabia but Afghanistan is rich in opium.  Therefore they’re not only profiting from oil but from the drugs as well.  Do you think these military bases are set up for war only?

  43. IndependentConservative Says:

    It’s not about the dope.  In fact, before 9/11 America was giving the Taliban millions to fight the spread of opium.

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