March 9, 2007

What’s the Matter With Rick Warren? A Lot!

by @ 1:11 pm. Filed under Nuts on Parade

I’m just going to cut to the quick and start detailing why Rick Warren is more harmful to the faith than some might suspect.

First off, he’s OK with teaming with people involved in cults and watering down his own ministry of the Gospel, if it means he can give somebody a hot meal. He’s emphasizing physical charity over spiritual ministry.

From NBC Meet the Press Transcript 12/24/2006

DR. WARREN: Well, it?s a good concern. That?s true, most of the world is non-Christian, two thirds is not, but the?most of the world has faith of some kind. For instance, there are 600,000 Buddhists in the world, there are 800,000 Hindus, there are 1.3 billion Muslims and 2.3 billion Christians. The actual number of true secularists is actually quite small outside of Manhattan or Europe. So most people have a faith. Now, if you say you have to put your faith on the shelf to do humanitarian aid, you?ve ruled out most of the world. And, and so what I?m saying is, I honestly don?t care what your motivation is to do good, as long as you do good. You might have a political motivation. Somebody comes and says to you, ?It makes good sense?it?s good foreign policy for us to help people get well, like with AIDS.? I?ve noticed they tend to like your country when you help them out. It?s just flat out good foreign policy to do health care, OK? That?s not my motivation, but it?s fine. Then there might be a political?a profit motivation, make money and help people. I wish more businesses did it.

By Rick?s own definition, Arab Muslims working in Africa is good, so long as they provide medical care.

Here’s more from him. (Same transcript)

I feel deeply about pro-life, very deeply about it. I?m a staunch pro-lifer. But I will work with anyone on anything if we can work together.

Warren does not realize that he is the one putting his faith on the shelf. But hey, who needs Jesus if they?ve got medical care? I mean all he did was heal people right? (sarcasm)

He goes on to say:

I don?t agree with everything my gay friends agree with, and they don?t agree with everything I, I believe in, but if they want to work on AIDS, we?ll work with them. We?ll work with anybody. That?s this civility of, to quote that great theologian Rodney King, ?Can?t we just get along?? And have?look at what?s the common good.

So work with the homosexuals on AIDS, just don?t go telling them they need to repent or anything. After all, Jesus just ran around healing people, right? (sarcasm)

Folks, we should not compromise the ministry of the Gospel of Jesus Christ, just so we can say we gave some AIDS medicine to someone and the pro-gay lobby gave us money to help do it. While on earth in flesh, Jesus always ensured that he and his disciples sent the message of repentance along with their humanitarian efforts. That means the pro-gay crowd and the Muslims won’t want to work with someone engaged in true Christian ministry. Likewise the Christian would not desire to work with those not helping to spread the message of Jesus Christ! Jesus told people “go and sin no more”, not go ahead and sin and we’ll hand out some condoms in the morning, or you hand out the condoms and I’ll hand out an AIDS pamphlet, whatever works for you so long as we can do it together.

ABCNews program Nightlne did a report about Warren this week. And one who saw what Warren’s efforts can turn a church group into offered his opinion.

Rick Warren and Purpose-Driven Strife

One of the first people to leave Bartlett’s church was a retired pastor, Joe Owings.

“Well, the preaching was very much topical preaching,” Owings said about the church he parted from in North Carolina. “It tended to deal with how to have a better marriage, or how to do this or how to do this. It was more self-help type ministry.”

When asked if he believed that some churches had become pop psychology centers focusing too much on self-esteem and well-being, Owings said, “Yes. It’s merchandising. ? It tends to use psychological techniques. And it quotes more Freud, maybe, than it does the Bible.”

When I hear Warren on the radio I feel exactly the same as Owings. And let me tell you folks, old ministers know the game backwards and forwards. So heed when an elder of the church says there is a problem. (See: 1 Peter 5) Churches like Warren’s always succeed in having “elders” who are about 45 years old and usually have been saved for about 10 years or less, while all the older more seasoned saints like Owings leave.

Now granted when Warren is confronted with these concerns he has a ready defense, but his church and others continue to do it.

See the full video ABCNews report here. Hat tip goes to Bryan at Hot Air.

You know I’ve already had to cover the truth regarding tithes. Does Rick Warren’s new style church teach the new covenant form of giving money? You’ve got to be kidding!

Living with purpose – Chicago Tribune article hosted on the Saddleback Church (Warren’s church) web site

For his part, Warren says he hears all the time that Saddleback is, as he puts it, “a shallow, superficial church that caters to the whims of consumeristic Christianity.” But he points out that Saddleback’s membership requirements include a pledge to tithe (give 10 percent of your income to the church) and to go on humanitarian mission trips.

And given he’s working with non-Christians for the sake of humanitarian work, those missions will be limited regarding how much actual ministry of the Gospel of Jesus Christ that they will do. Wouldn’t want to offend anybody you know.

Now when it comes to Warren’s church endorsing false teaching regarding tithes, just look at how they bind people who question them. And this is another one right off Warren’s church web site.

Tithe on gross or net?

Question: I know that tithing is supposed to be giving 10 percent to the Lord. Is that 10 percent of the gross or of the net after taxes? I don’t know that I could afford to give 10 percent of what I earn before taxes!

The person is obviously hurting to make ends meet and hoping to be faithful while still being able to be an honest broker with people they are in debt to. I’ve already explained how Christians are not bound under the old Jewish law of tithing. A law that even today’s Orthodox Jews don’t adhere to, because the Levitical priests are dead. For Christians the old law is dead and we live in the newness of Grace, that came with the sacrifice and resurrection of Jesus Christ. But Warren’s church like others tell people who struggle the following lies.

From the answer given by Tom Holladay at Saddleback.

The practice that Christians have always carried out is the giving of 10 percent back to the Lord of ALL that the Lord has given to you – your gross.

The correct answer would have been that Christians are not bound under the law and should give as the Lord leads. But look what is said in the Lord’s name.

The Lord could have asked us to give 50 percent to him, but he chose 10 percent.

Jesus never paid tithes, the apostles never paid tithes, Jesus never collected tithes, the apostles never collected tithes, but just like many churches regarding this false teaching, Saddleback goes with the old school lie when it comes to money 😉 .

Then comes the talk about others who gave 10% seeing earthly life changing blessings.

Yet when they’ve started to give they have seen God bless them in a way that was life-changing.

Notice they never tell you about all the people who give and now their creditors are not seeing them as such good Christians. This is why people should give as led by the Lord. So that they can be honest brokers with creditors and give as would be best for their circumstances. Notice the responses to tithes never mention Jesus telling the rich man to give all his money to THE POOR. I mean if you gave it all to THE POOR than Saddleback would not get A DIME.

And then comes the pitch to start paying that 10% of gross NOW.

I’d encourage you to start now and make the sacrifice to tithe beginning this next month. Read Malachi chapter 3 (the last book in the Old Testament). You’ll find a verse where God encourages us to test him in this by tithing.

Never mind those creditors and your family needs, give to Saddleback (oh they say God) now.

1 Timothy 5:8 (New King James Version)

8) But if anyone does not provide for his own, and especially for those of his household, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.

Matthew 25:31-46 mentions to us that we see Jesus when we see the needy, but at Saddleback they are instructed to give that 10% to “Saddleback”. No mention is made that Malachi was a prophet to the Jews of Israel regarding the old covenant, that passed away with the new covenant explained in Hebrews 7 & 8. The claim is made that God encourages “us” to test “Him” by tithing, when God was encouraging Jews before Christ came to earth in flesh to test him in a form of tithing that is NOTHING like what is taught at Saddleback. Read that whole book of Malachi and you find they actually were “paying” tithes and offerings, but not as God commanded!

And how come today’s pastors never preach about the apostle Paul working as a tent maker to take care of himself? (See: Acts 18) Going places and WORKING A REGULAR JOB, while also ministering and giving money to the needy, to the point he was broke himself. Today the pastors, associates pastors and even musicians are taking a salary at many churches. (In some cases it is a Love Offering. Some pastors say that they give it away, but why take it in the first place if you don’t intend to keep it? Tell the people to give it away like Jesus did.) When Jesus collected money it was actually used for ministry, except what Judas was stealing, which Jesus knew about but allowed given scriptures had to be fulfilled. Maybe Saddleback is not so “new” in some ways after all.

Here’s what Melvin Jones at Pulpit Pimps has to say about Warren and his book “The Purpose Driven Life”.

Purpose Driven Tripe or The Bible Driven Life

Rick Warren, the author of the now ubiquitous ?The Purpose Driven Life (TPDL)? is probably doing more to destroy Christianity than Calypso Louie (AKA The Honorable Louis Farrakhan) has ever done.

Read it all. You know Melvin always fully details his statements with an avalanche of proof.

Now some of you might say I’m somehow wrong to be critical of someone who claims the faith. I say to you, that you should consider reading The Word of God for yourself and being critical of those who come to you with something they claim is “new”.

2 Timothy 3:12-17 (New King James Version)

12) Yes, and all who desire to live godly in Christ Jesus will suffer persecution.

13) But evil men and impostors will grow worse and worse, deceiving and being deceived.

14) But you must continue in the things which you have learned and been assured of, knowing from whom you have learned them,

15) and that from childhood you have known the Holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

16) All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness,

17) that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.

Who would rather I see the wolf, who does all he can in the name of “growth” and not warn you? Even if you rebuke me, I’m still going to have enough LOVE for you to inform you that you’re being influenced by a WOLF. And having done that, at judgment you will have to assume responsibility for your choice and I won’t face judgment for not warning you of the danger I saw.

One Response to “What’s the Matter With Rick Warren? A Lot!”

  1. IndependentConservative Says:

    In the post I should have noted that in Matthew 25:31-46 Jesus is speaking about how we treat “one of these brothers of Mine”, meaning fellow saints. We should do good to all while not forsaking the gospel, but our focus in terms of welfare is primarily the welfare of fellow saints, Galatians 6:10.

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